Family Ties
Nov. 15th, 2005 08:27 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
author_by_night
One of the (many) debates in fanfic writing is the usage of original characters. A debate within the debate is whether or not to give canon characters relatives.
I believe the situation originally arose from upstaging. Helen Granger is in every way smarter than her sister – on top of being inarguably gorgeous and magically gifted. Hermione is no longer important to the trio. Or we meet Harriet Potter, who captivates Harry to the point where Ron and Hermione are but distant memories.
But is it fair to use those examples for arguments that no character should be given family members?
The problem with this reasoning is that first of all, it’s virtually impossible that every Potterverse character is an only child/parentless/loverless/childless/etc. We even see in OoTP and possibly HBP (if you believe RAB is Regulus A Black), that JK Rowling herself has given characters significant siblings and relatives.
So when is the line drawn? I have made a few lists. Note that I mean close relatives – siblings, spouses, grandparents, cousins, children.
Some characters that are family member safe (FMS):
1. Mundungus Fletcher. We really don’t know that he doesn’t have a wife, even, though that’s not too likely (she probably would’ve been at an Order meeting). But a brother or sister who either considers him or herself to be far more honorable than dear Dung? Or a sibling who is actually partly why Dung hasn’t landed himself in Azkaban? An embarrassed daughter (who is out of Hogwarts)? It could be quite interesting.
2. Ted Tonks. There is no reason he couldn’t have any siblings – and I think it would be interesting to see Tonks and muggle cousin. The only possible pitfall I can see here is that Tonks didn’t seem to know much about muggles, judging from OoTP. (she’s fascinated with the Dursleys and says something to the effect of “I didn’t know muggles were neat freaks, Dad’s a right slob,”). Therefore, the author would have to work carefully with the latter. Same goes with Tonks being close to muggle grandparents who are still living – then why doesn’t she seem to be that familiar with the muggle world?
3. Kingsley Shacklebot. There is no evidence that he does not have any relatives, although as he has been at the Order HQ more than once on a social basis, there is little chance that he is married. But any other relative works.
Some characters that are only FMS with caution:
1. Remus Lupin. Given his reaction to Tonks in OoTP, it is highly unlikely he is a “first war widow”, and I think it would have been mentioned if he had a child Harry’s age. Siblings are a bit hard as well – I don’t think he could have more than one, unless the others weren’t in close capacity. It’s just not likely we wouldn’t know. I myself have given Remus a younger sister, Artemis, and one plothole I’ve found is that it’s also very unlikely Remus’s parents would have had another child post- The Bite. I have since decided she wasn’t “planned”, and that we don’t see her because she’s been living abroad. A friend of mine, Linda, gives Remus a brother who was born before the bite, and who has a distant relationship with Remus. As far as parents go – I think it’s more than possible for them to still be alive.
2. Severus Snape. I sincerely feel that if he does have any family members, the relationship must be written in character. Snape isn’t going to get teary over a Christmas present, and sadly, I doubt he’s ever said “I love you” past the age of five. Having Eileen Prince still be alive works, but it’s going to be a complex mother-son relationship, if there’s any at all.
3. Albus Dumbledore. This one is tricky, because it’s mixed. On one hand, you’d think any living relative of Dumbledore’s would be known about. On the other, nobody has pointed out who Aberforth is, and Aberforth is never mentioned when Dumbledore is ridiculed for his other ties (ie Remus and Moody). Is it because Dumbledore’s less famous than we think? Or is it because Aberforth is a recluse? Or is it a flint? It’s tricky, and when adding any other loved ones, this must be kept in mind. It’s also worth noting that Dumbledore is somewhat distant.
4. Ron. We already heard of an Aunt Muriel, and it’s possible he has more relatives. But once again, this has to be worked with. Why, if he does, do we never see or hear of them? As far as the “seventh brother/sister goes”, it’s possible (after all, Ron has never mentioned that at least two close relatives died because of Death Eaters), but not too likely. I think this, at least, would have been mentioned at some point. Wouldn’t Molly have mentioned losing a child?
5. Hermione. Grandparents, cousins, and such? That works. But please, no little sister. That’s been ruled out.
Some characters that are almost definitely not FMS:
1. Harry. By now, we would know. The only way this could be possible is if Lily had miscarried, and still, I think Sirius or Remus would’ve told him. And if he had a living sibling out there, Dumbledore would have mentioned it. Wouldn’t he say, “and by the way Harry, while you’re Horcrux Hunting, keep an eye out for a girl with red hair and green eyes?” Finally, JKR has made it clear that all close relatives of Harry’s are dead. I suppose one could work with an extremely distant relative (I’m sure he must have some), but that’s all.
2. Sirius. We’ve met all his relatives (except Andromeda), and we know he was never married. Distant kin is probable, but I doubt he has a sister or a brother who simply never appeared on the tree.
I do want to note that for the most part, fics that were written prior to there being any reason for these characters not to have close relatives, AU fics, and RPG’s don’t count (the latter being because in many RPG’s, canon is disregarded to some extent anyway). If you planned a novel length fanfic about Sirius’s wife pre-JKR’s site and/or pre-OoTP/HBP, keep writing it, but note that it is no longer canon.
Back on topic. What should one look for when giving a character a close family member? It’s not too hard.
1. Upstaging. This goes for any OC - they should not upstage the canon role of a character. If you want to have an OC think Dumbledore isn’t always right, that’s fine – plenty of people do. But don’t have that Dumbledore eats “Mudbloods” for dinner. He has faults, but one of his strong points is muggle tolerance. Don’t take that away.
2. Implausibility. There is no way that Harry’s twin sister crawled out of the rubble and was found by a lovely American couple. Wouldn’t Hagrid have mentioned not being able to find Harriet? Wouldn’t Sirius have accused Peter of killing Harriett too?
3. Immediate Redemption. If Snape finds out he has an illegitimate child, he will not immediately soften up and sing “Amazing Grace.” It is more
likely that he will bang his head against the wall, and pretend he doesn’t believe it. If he does believe it.
4. Parallels that are a tad too ironic. Harriet doesn’t have to have a moon shaped scar on her chin.
It is not always taboo to write family relationships; the problem is that sometimes, family members “butt in.” But perhaps even that is a reflection of real life!
(Note: Sorry if the formatting is a tad off, I copied this from word. <i>Please</i> don't only comment with that unless it honestly makes it impossible to read. Thanks).
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no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 03:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 05:27 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 03:17 pm (UTC)My story (not archived anywhere)revolved around the bite, and becoming a werewolf.
Remus (age 9) and his sister (Roma, age 5) were playing outside when they were attacked. Remus was bitten trying to save Roma (Who died later of her injuries anyway).
Remus's parents did all they could to try to help the child they had left. It was very angsty, perhaps a bit too angsty, so I don't plan on putting it up anywhere.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 03:37 pm (UTC)Are you nuts?! It sounds great!
Please at least send it to me.
And I gave Remus a sister too, as I mentioned. Probably improbable, but not all kids are "planned", and in your case, it's definitely plausible.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 03:56 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 05:11 pm (UTC)We do know from JKR that Draco is an only child, but for all we know his Granddad Abraxas and Granny Whatever see him every summer. Pansy Parkinson could well have a sister named Hyacinth or something. If it's plausible and not directly contradicted by canon, then unknown relatives are fine.
I love the idea of Dung having an embarrassed daughter, who maybe took a job in Romania just so that she could get away from her dad's bad reputation...
no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 05:26 pm (UTC)*Raises eyebrows* A reference to one Hyacinth
BucketBouquet? Or am I just showing my former BBC geek?(If you don't know, it was a name of an exceptionally snooty woman in a British tv show.)
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Date: 2005-11-16 12:54 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 12:55 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 01:22 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 05:51 pm (UTC)My!Remus is an only child, but actually I think it's entirely possible that he could have siblings we wouldn't know about because they're not part of Harry's story. When would he have had occasion to mention them? Not during PoA, because Harry doesn't know anything of his personal life until the end, and he only has a few cameos in OotP and HBP. And he could easily have been six or seven at the time he was bitten, an age when most people already have all the siblings they're ever going to have.
Ron. We already heard of an Aunt Muriel, and it’s possible he has more relatives. But once again, this has to be worked with. Why, if he does, do we never see or hear of them?
I agree that a deceased Weasley sibling is unlikely, but assuming that we're talking about aunts / uncles / cousins / grandparents, I think anything is fair game. (JKR mentioned on her web site that Arthur was one of three brothers, and it's unlikely that Ron's uncles are ALL dead.) The relevant question, I think, isn't "Why do we never see or hear of them?" but "Is there a good reason why we should see or hear of them -- would this information would be relevant to Harry's story?" These are storybooks, not encyclopedias, and they certainly don't recount every conversation Ron and Harry have ever had in their six years of friendship -- just the ones that add something to the characterization or plot. So I'd say fanwriters have a lot of leeway to develop new relatives IF their existence doesn't screw with plot points that are already set in stone (such as Harry being an orphan with no relatives other than the Dursleys).
no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 08:25 pm (UTC)As with Ron and his family- he was supposed to have a cousin, who turned into that awful reporter. I could give him a cousin, but as above, not too much emphasis or screentime, they'd be extras, something to spice up the story and make it seem a little different than others.
I think that a story with Sirius' brother, Regulus never killed would be cool, but only if the writer were talented and did it RIGHT.
For the most part, what you say is true for the writers who can't do characters well, especially semi-original ones, but I think that the writers of good caliber who can handle these things with caliber are exempted.
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Date: 2005-11-15 08:28 pm (UTC)BTW, if you paste it into Word pad and copy it first the weird formatting should go away.
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Date: 2005-11-15 10:05 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-15 10:05 pm (UTC)Dang it... plot idea...
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Date: 2005-11-16 12:48 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 01:24 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 12:57 am (UTC)I've found one way to interject new siblings is to have them much older or much younger than the canon character involved. While this wouldn't work for Harry or any other character who isn't stated as an only child, this could work for, say, Remus, who might have been born in his parents later years [since wizards live longer, a lot of people assume the women stay fertile longer], or he might have had a sibling born when he was in his teens or young adult years- someone far enough in age that he probably wouldn't have really gotten a chance to bond with him or her.
I usually shy away from stories were major canon characters have closely related siblings who we should have heard from by now, or stories were Sirius has a love-child, because unless Azkaban has conjungal visits, they usually get the birthdates wrong. [And who wants to shag with the Dementors watching, anyways? They'd suck all the joy out of it, no pun intended.]
Anyways, I think in most cases, there are different ways to get around it, so long as the author is careful.
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Date: 2005-11-16 12:58 am (UTC)>.
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Date: 2005-11-16 02:09 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 06:48 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 12:31 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 09:17 pm (UTC)From D_S
Date: 2005-11-16 01:46 am (UTC)I agree. I think it can work if writers use a little common sense.
I find it hard to believe that if Harry had a long lost sibling he or she hasn't been mentioned once by any of the characters. I also find it tough to believe that if Hermione or Ron had a long lost sibling they haven't once been mentioned in the six years they've know each other.
That's not true for all characters though, since the books are in Harry's POV I can think of several reasons why he wouldn't know about someone's family.
McGonagall could have a husband or adult children that we haven't heard of because I can't see her talking it over with her students.
Same for Snape if he does have relatives he's close with why would he tell it to a student he dislikes?
Trelawnly could have parents or siblings that she hasn't mentioned [maybe because they don't have an 'Inner Eye'] and so forth.
Re: From D_S
Date: 2005-11-16 03:48 am (UTC)My, my, that James is an impatient fellow. Poor Lily.
It can work if, as you said, the authors use a little common sense. I would love to see, say, McGonagall's older sister or maybe Snape's cousin- if it could be written correctly. *sighs*
Thus is fandom, I suppose.
Re: From D_S
Date: 2005-11-16 03:51 am (UTC)Re: From D_S
Date: 2005-11-16 12:29 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 01:38 am (UTC)Sirius has a mom with a (terrible) personality, a dad, and a brother, and lots of cousins to despise. Why is poor Remus so neglected? Just because he's a werewolf, he doesn't get a mom? Tonks has a mom and a dad, with personalities and everything. Even Draco Malfoy has a named grandfather.
Also, do you know whether any of the faculty is married? Is McGonagal? How about Flitwick? We know Snape isn't, but he's at least got a mom and dad with a name, as of HBP. Also we know that his folks didn't get along, which would account for his being an only child.
It's just an example of canon leaving the characters way too flat. I think it's perfectly okay to give them families. Yes, they should be canon-compliant and not mary sue-ish, but I don't see why not give them some background.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 01:49 am (UTC)I think it's more like someone else said, the HP series are storybooks not encyclopedia's. We don't need to know about Vernon's Dad, Molly's second cousin, or Hooch's sister, because they aren't really important to the storyline.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 02:12 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 02:15 am (UTC)Or maybe it's just that when I was in high school, I knew who of my classmates had brothers and sisters, and who was living with one parent, and who was living with two. I even knew things about my classmates' grandparents, and that included people with whom I was not particularly friendly. A cultural difference between me and JKR? Or a sign that the novels are from Harry's perspective and that he's not particularly perceptive?
I should also add that my favorite novel is A Suitable Boy (http://www.english.emory.edu/Bahri/Seth.html) by Vikram Seth. It was originally 2,000 pages long, but he pared it down to a mere 1,349 pages. (!@!) He fleshed out EVERY character. So that affects how I think about this.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 03:04 am (UTC)The fact that the readers don't know something doesn't mean that Harry doesn't know it. I'm sure he's known for years whether Dean, Lavender, and Seamus have brothers and sisters, for instance, it's just that there isn't any reason why a conversation where this information came up would be important enough to be relayed to the reader, unless their siblings were going to serve some sort of plot function.
We know about the Blacks and the Weasleys because they're important to the story; we don't know about the Lupins and the Grangers because they aren't, and the books are long enough as it is.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 12:28 pm (UTC)And I don't know that the books would mention it anyway, if there were no reason to.
I think it was fairly obvious Hermione was an only child, because we see her in every chapter, she mentions her family quite a bit, etc.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 03:12 am (UTC)Also, I happen to like original characters. Of course they're done badly, but a lot of what I enjoy in reading fanfiction is more of the sociology, how the wizarding world works, how different people react to it. One of the best ways of doing that is through the eyes of a OC. I don't think you should dismiss having a main character be an original character out of hand, there are several great OC fics out there.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 09:00 am (UTC)World-driven fic vs. character-driven fic. *nods* I'm a worldficcer myself, and I write primarily OC-centric stories for that exact reason, to give an outsider perspective on a familiar world.
As far as OCs as main characters, I agree with the OP in that they shouldn't upstage the canon characters' role (emphasis mine). IMO, an OC can be the star of their particular story, but their plot should be distinct-- they should not, for instance, be the brightest witch of their generation, or be the one tasked with saving the world from Voldemort. Give them something to do which doesn't interfere with what the canon characters are doing.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 03:48 pm (UTC)I'm sorry, I misunderstood, I thought that by saying an OC shouldn't upstage a canon character's role that you meant an OC should never be a main character in a fic. It didn't occur to me that you meant they should not take the place of a canon character. Sorry about that. I totally agree with you that if you're going to have an OC you should make him/her their own person, not just use them as an excuse to make another Harry, only without all of the pesky canon restrictions on who Harry is.
Also, mind linking me to some of your fics? It's so hard to find good OC centric fics....
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 12:14 pm (UTC)And I love OC's; this is not anti-OC. (There's enough of that in fandom). Itt's just saying that sometimes, OC's do upstage.
here from D_S
Date: 2005-11-16 09:15 am (UTC)As for Harry, it's certainly possible that he has more distant relatives, second cousins and the like. Not a sibling, though, not unless James got up to some hanky-panky with someone other than Lily before he died. (It would, though, be kind of interesting to postulate a cousin through Petunia. She *could* have gotten pregnant and given the child up for adoption before marrying Vernon...)
I have a lot of plots in my head that I've never gotten around to writing, and in one of them I'm guilty of giving Voldemort a daughter and granddaughter. I don't think handsome, charismatic Tom Riddle was above using sex as a means to get ahead, although any girl unlucky enough to end up pregnant by him would have had to go through exceptional means to keep him unaware of the pregnancy.
Re: here from D_S
Date: 2005-11-16 12:24 pm (UTC)As for Harry, yes, definitely second cousins. But I just think if he had another aunt, (especially on the wizarding side), Harry'd have known.
Wow to your Riddle idea - you know, youu're right, too. He was sick enough.
no subject
Date: 2005-11-16 07:06 pm (UTC)Personally, in my Tonksfic a number of minor or very minor characters ended up with surnames deliberately taken from canon, the implication being that they're random cousins or uncles or whatever. (Although one character to whom I gave a common surname -- Davies -- ended up as a cousin of Roger's when I realised that the names were the same and it would give a useful conduit for a throwaway bit of news from Hogwarts!)
Of course, none of these characters should end up becoming more important in the wizarding world than the known canon storyline can stand. (I just about got away with that when my "Scrimgeour" was retconned after HBP to Rufus' great-uncle -- it's a GoF-era story so leaves scope for shuffling him out of the picture before OotP.) But apart from that important rider, relatives of canon characters are fair enough.